Do NOT Pray for Dave

Continuing in this Do NOT Pray series:


Fascinating discussion over at Dave's site.
A complete inability to deal with any of the biblical passages that I provided.  Or even try.


Instead Calvin is invoked as a straw man (a man that I never invoked).  And Calvin is claimed to be a Universalist in regards to prayer.  And a Universalist in regards to salvation.  Bizarre misrepresentations.


But I'm not going to play their Calvin card.  Not going to try dredge up some peculiar sermon.  Not going to take Calvin out of context as they were shown that they did.
Not because I can't find a refutation- but because (as I said) I am not slavish to Calvin but to Scripture.


Now, having provided considerable scripture (numerous precepts and precedents) as to why a Christian should not pray for apostates (but rather "pray against them")... we will now turn to several principles surrounding this special pleading.  Several principles against Universal Prayer.


1.  It presumes too much-
Jesus did not "ask on behalf of the world" (John 17:9).  Did not ask on behalf of the Universe.  Did not pray for the Universe.  Did not pray for "all men".  So what gives us the right to?


2.  It presumes too little-
Perhaps we should be praying for Satan and his angels as well then?  Bugs and bunnies?




3.  Different strokes for different folks-
Some folks need different types of prayer.  As I mentioned, some need imprecatory prayer.  A 'kicking of the pricks' (Acts 9:5 KJV).


4.  Argument from silence-
After tossing the bum from church (Matt. 18:18)- the church is not asked to pray for him.  He is left to his own devices.  Solitary devices.  A Jewish device.


5.  Waste of time-
Don't waste perfectly good prayer time on those that give strong indication of being apostates.
If they are- it is IMPOSSIBLE to renew them again to repentance (Hebrews 6:6).




6.  Waste of love-
i)  Now some Universalists will claim that we are to love our enemies.  That is true.
But to extend that to 'loving our enemies as ourselves'... is false.  A false extension.
To extend that to 'loving our enemies to the same extent' (Marouns argument) is contrary to Gal 6:10.
A biblical distinction that should be upheld... with prioritized prayer for "those of the household of faith".
And prioritized providence for your own household (1 Tim. 5:8). 


ii)  And Universalists often appeal to the parable of The Good Samaritan.  That we should be Good Samaritans to everyone.  But there is no indication that the waylaid man was an enemy in this parable.  An enemy to the Gospel.  Or least of all an apostate.  We are only told that he was "a man".


Yet, we have far more information on Dave.  Lots of information on Dave.   Lots of indication that Dave is an enemy.  The worst kind of enemy... an enemy of the Gospel.
Lots of indication that Dave is an enemy of the sufficiency of Christ.  A false brother.   A brother intent on bringing us back into sacramental bondage (Gal 2:4).  Into "dead works" (Hebrews 6:1).  A brother that "nullifies the grace of God" (Gal. 2:21).


Indications that the apostle Paul deemed sufficient- to  hand lotsa folks over to Satan for. 
Indications that Rome considers sufficient to hand me over ("anathematize") to Satan for.
And indications that I would deem sufficient to hand 'brother Dave' over to Satan for.


So then should I pray for Dave... after handing him over?
That would be schizophrenic.  Double-minded and dumb.


Don't be dumb, folks.

Do NOT Pray for Patty!

Continuing in this Do NOT Pray series:


Went to daring-Dave Armstrong's site via TurretinFan.  And found Patty Bonds drooling over one of Dave's posts on masturbation.
A tipping point for Dave.  And a tipping point for Patty ("an allegedly virtuous device... that I turned into an idolatrous vice"). 


Have covered that topic extensively at my adult blog... but I thought I'd chronicle Patty's fall from grace here.
Patty's drifting from the virtuous church of her childhood... to her fall [a Hebrews 6:6 distinction] into a vacuous cloister of sacraments.
From her own testimonies here and here:


As many of you know, Patty is the sister of premier Protestant-apologist James White.  And daughter of a Protestant pastor.
Born in '56.  'Prayed the prayer' at the age of six.  And married at 25.
But she converted to Catholicism 16 years ago, despite tremendous opportunity to see Jesus as sufficient.  And continues to be a tremendous thorn in James and his fathers side.
Her mothers side.
And her ex-husbands side.


Patty divorced her husband of 21 years because "he couldn't deal with the fact that I had not been open with him"  [her deception and manipulation].
Because "he was not as sensitive as he should have been" [despite going to numerous counseling sessions to deal with her numerous issues].
And because her marriage "wasn't all that it could be" [even after he became a Catholic for her].


Patty later applied for and was granted "the 8th sacrament" (an Annulment).   A grand illusion.
Was granted the delusion that it never was a "sacramental" marriage.
The delusion that it never was a "true" marriage [as if only "sacramental marriages" are "true" marriages].
And now promotes this vacuous delusion.


Patty later applied for and was granted the Sacrament of Consecration.   Granted the delusion that she is now a Sacred spouse of Christ [and that her children are now Sacred].  And now promotes this vacuous delusion as well.


She made the Vow of Celibacy in '05.  Another vacuous vow.  Considering her circumstances.
A vow clearly made without an elementary understanding of  her "Matthew 19:12 theme".
 
Ans a vow of questionable value at best.  From a single mother of three.  And a grandmother of one.  To now dedicate her life to proclaiming a questionable gospel... while remaining a civil servant. 


Yet Patty may be applying for yet another vacuous  sacrament soon.  The Sacrament of Final Unction.


You see, Patty continues to have her problems.  Major physical problems.
Patty will be seeing a breast surgeon this week.  To have one of her "ladies" taken care of.
Something that she "should have done long ago...  but had procrastinated".
Procrastination "due to a cyst on her kidneys. spots on her lungs, and brain tumors impacting her senses".


Yup, here is a lady that is far from healed.  Either physically or spiritually.
And of course, it's never her fault.  It's her husbands fault, her fathers fault, her mothers fault...


Yet somehow she feels these faults are  "re-storing her to the person that she should be".
As she continues "trying to restore" her daddy to the person he should be.
A daddy of  her fantasies.


You see, "Daddy's little girl" continues to accuse her daddy of atrocious things. Fantastical things.  And can't get past her fantastical past.  An enormously improbable past (considering even some of the factors).
A fantastical past that many patients develop after entering therapy.
A past that her mother thinks was generated from a therapist at Moody.
A therapy that was all the rage at the time.  A therapy that has seen numerous lawsuits.


Yet, "Daddy's little girl" continues to slander her father and mother.
Knowingly, "trampling on the law of God".  The fifth commandment.
A commandment granting longevity...  for those that honor their father and mother.  


And the 'restoring spirit' that Patty thinks she is bringing to bear on her father... is a dishonoring spirit.
A malicious spirit.  A destructive spirit.  A spirit eager to accuse.
To accuse her father, mother, husband and brother.


And I should support Patty's spirit?  I should pray for Patty?


Well... pray like King David often prayed, perhaps.
Imprecatory prayers.  Praying against her.
Pray that she might fall into the pit... the pit that she laid for her father (Psalm 57:6).
Pray that the Patty we currently know "may be no more (Psalm 59:13)".


Or as Oswald Chambers would pray, "Pray that things might get a hundred times worse for her"...
that she might see the sufficiency of Jesus.
The insufficiency of Rome and the vacuity of her sacraments...  including the Final Sacrament.